tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-19336675.post383997311483473733..comments2023-11-03T06:02:02.128-07:00Comments on By Ken Levine: My pitch for MONEYBALLBy Ken Levinehttp://www.blogger.com/profile/17305293821975250420noreply@blogger.comBlogger30125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-19336675.post-48082462413424284742011-10-31T16:37:13.220-07:002011-10-31T16:37:13.220-07:00Aside from focusing on OBP, another way to win che...Aside from focusing on OBP, another way to win cheap is to have your stars juiced up to their eyebrows. <br /><br /> Giambi, Tejada, maybe Chavez...<br /><br /> More artistic license!Chrisnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-19336675.post-55151281814696787552011-10-13T17:56:02.469-07:002011-10-13T17:56:02.469-07:00Ref, I wasn't joking. But I was also hoping f...Ref, I wasn't joking. But I was also hoping for an answer, not a homework assignment :)<br /><br />I will put that book on my list, though. Thanks.Dave Arnottnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-19336675.post-25524715564694353812011-10-12T16:40:10.222-07:002011-10-12T16:40:10.222-07:00Dave Arnott, there's a wonderful book titled &...Dave Arnott, there's a wonderful book titled "As They See 'Em" by a fan and amateur umpire named Bruce Weber. It's a wonderful baseball book that will really change how you see umpires. Or were you joking?Refnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-19336675.post-79338229201642302212011-10-12T16:13:08.963-07:002011-10-12T16:13:08.963-07:00FRIDAY QUESTION: Since I've been enjoying post...FRIDAY QUESTION: Since I've been enjoying post-season baseball so much (and without "my" team in the hunt, even), I was wondering... if you know...<br /><br />Where do Umpires come from?<br /><br />Now that I've likely set you up, seriously... are they mostly old players, because it seems like they aren't, which kinda surprises me. Do you have any inside knowledge in this area? Thanks.Dave Arnottnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-19336675.post-75715863838735630782011-10-12T07:21:45.331-07:002011-10-12T07:21:45.331-07:00I just want to know if Sorkin took even a nugget o...I just want to know if Sorkin took even a nugget of the "homage" scene you wrote about "if Sorkin ever did a baseball movie."Reboundinghttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01610595028216626302noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-19336675.post-3483734140871562652011-10-12T07:21:09.735-07:002011-10-12T07:21:09.735-07:00Any movie that reminds us that Bill King should be...Any movie that reminds us that Bill King should be in the baseball, football, and basketball halls of fame, and that his absence from the broadcasters' wings of those three institutions remains a crime, is fine with me.<br /><br />By the way, speaking of King being crazy, Hank Greenwald, who worked with him on Warriors broadcasts, told the story of the night King jumped from his seat and yelled at a referee to, uh, do something biologically impossible. It went out over the air. But on a more serious note, he is the greatest football radio guy I have ever heard, and I never thought I'd hear a better radio football broadcaster than Lindsey Nelson.Michaelhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01998867386294693956noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-19336675.post-72823036106875448252011-10-11T22:44:18.229-07:002011-10-11T22:44:18.229-07:00@ David
Thanks for the link to the Zaillian draft...@ David<br /><br />Thanks for the link to the Zaillian draft. I look forward to studying it. But I read the first 20 pages and aside from opening in the empty stadium, it doesn't seem to be anything like the movie. All the dialogue was rewritten, that I can see. But thanks.Frank Abehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13673713534990547166noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-19336675.post-34463037653141351252011-10-11T21:33:12.401-07:002011-10-11T21:33:12.401-07:00The last time I watched a baseball game was when t...The last time I watched a baseball game was when the Toronto Blue Jays won the World Series, and I know absolutely nothing about what happened a that time, but this is, so far, my favourite movie of the year. I thought it hit every note and entertained me like I wanted. Can't ask for anything more than that.Tim W.https://www.blogger.com/profile/16860726607106078491noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-19336675.post-47502413546595608072011-10-11T20:54:18.896-07:002011-10-11T20:54:18.896-07:00And seriously...Phillip Seymour Hoffman as Art How...And seriously...Phillip Seymour Hoffman as Art Howe??? Howe's waistline was the biggest distortion in this movie. Howe always looked like a drill sergeant. He was gaunt and muscular looking. Matt Frewer maybe.Ike Iszanyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00242135666260861294noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-19336675.post-90711358035518875242011-10-11T20:51:50.920-07:002011-10-11T20:51:50.920-07:00This movie distorted the facts to fit its own narr...This movie distorted the facts to fit its own narrative worse than Fox News. The idea is that the A's managed to replace free agent loses with veterans who walked a lot was pretty much disproven...by the Oakland A's themselves with GM Billy Beane. 2001 the A's win the division with the 3rd best OBP. 2002 they win the division with the 5th best OBP. In 2003 they win the division with the 10th best OBP. By 2003 they weren't even above average at getting on base but still won 99 games. Why? Because they had the best pitching in the league those three years. The movie mourns the loss of Johnny Damon who was there one year and was very mediocre. His numbers where not hard to replace. It mourns the loss of Jason Isringhausen but never mentions Billy Koch in 2002 and Keith Foulke in 2003 had much better years than Isringhausen had in 2001. The only thing they couldn't replace was Jason Giambi. Of course if Beane had held onto Carlos Pena he would at least have had a viable replacement who by the way, later in his career...would walk a lot. This movie was a snoozer. If they were going to distort the facts as much as they did they should have had the A's win a World Series.Ike Iszanyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00242135666260861294noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-19336675.post-10239108883893903762011-10-11T17:47:18.098-07:002011-10-11T17:47:18.098-07:00Ken, while I, too, adore Aaron Sorkin, it's to...Ken, while I, too, adore Aaron Sorkin, it's tough to see people give him *lots* of credit here after reading this 2008 Steve Zaillian draft, which you can see is, like, 85-90% of the current movie:<br />http://pursuethepassion.jobing.com/ebook/MoneyballScript.pdfDavidnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-19336675.post-25063218421952691432011-10-11T16:50:12.140-07:002011-10-11T16:50:12.140-07:00As long as the Rangers are playing Moneyball, I wi...As long as the Rangers are playing Moneyball, I will be happy.HogsAteMySisterhttp://hogsatemysister.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-19336675.post-29624279759542465962011-10-11T14:59:56.495-07:002011-10-11T14:59:56.495-07:00Interesting that you cite the movie's omission...Interesting that you cite the movie's omission of how important its star pitchers were, Tejada, etc., while you don't say a thing about Jonah Hill. The back-and-forth between Beane and Hill's character, "Peter Brand" -- an amalgam of Paul DePodesta and other Beane deputies -- were one of the movie's high points for me, and it was a pleasure to see Hill tone down his usual antics and create a lot of chemistry with Pitt in a mostly serious role.Davidhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00740239938140454237noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-19336675.post-72961030114868686622011-10-11T13:57:54.097-07:002011-10-11T13:57:54.097-07:00I remember 2002 vividly because my beloved Angels ...I remember 2002 vividly because my beloved Angels won the World Series that year.<br /><br />One remarkable tidbit about the A's winning streak-- while Oakland was winning 20 games in a row the Angels went 18-2 over that same stretch. The other thing I remember is that the Angels got off to a horrible start that year, they were 6-14 after a blow out loss to the Mariners and then went 93-49 (.654%) the rest of the way.l.a.guynoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-19336675.post-61223229558000140212011-10-11T13:39:39.897-07:002011-10-11T13:39:39.897-07:00@Jay,
That is future Hall of Fame broadcaster for...@Jay,<br /><br />That is future Hall of Fame broadcaster for both the Oakland Athletics and Raiders Bill King. A pretty crazy guy.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-19336675.post-12464916020831390832011-10-11T12:29:06.577-07:002011-10-11T12:29:06.577-07:00@Mike Barer, Grady is Grady Fuson who was with the...@Mike Barer, Grady is Grady Fuson who was with the Padres as VP of Scouting from 05-09.<br /><br />Great review Ken. I was wondering when we would get your thoughts. I loved this movie. 2 hours went by too fast. Brad Pitt almost said more when there was no dialogue. That's acting. Also great point, and one that annoys me in reviews of movies based on true stories, that this is a fictionalization not a documentary.Suenoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-19336675.post-84964688283731199202011-10-11T12:25:30.935-07:002011-10-11T12:25:30.935-07:00So Ken, whats your feeling in general about Hollyw...So Ken, whats your feeling in general about Hollywood rewriting history? Smoothing out a baseball story when everybody who cares still remembers the actual facts is probably low end. Rewriting important history is a different thing altogether, no matter how good the writing. Discuss.<br />(I guess us Brits get our knickers in a twist more than most, especially about WW2.)Looseheadnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-19336675.post-22845728905302538562011-10-11T11:24:23.985-07:002011-10-11T11:24:23.985-07:00I kind of love baseball and so I have a hard time ...I kind of love baseball and so I have a hard time knowing if this film would be as enjoyable to people who don't but...<br /><br />I find it kind of amusing how much baseball chatter there is in discussions of this movie when, at its heart, its not (like you said) about baseball. <br /><br />IMHO it is about how prejudice clouds judgement and can lead to institutionalized error.<br /><br />In this case, the success of using stats to help pick players exposes a deep vein of prejudice in how choosing players was going on.<br /><br />The beauty of the narrative is that the man using the stats HIMSELF got into baseball because scouts completely misjudged him because he represented the poster-boy image of a baseball hero they had in their heads.<br /><br />Its a great part for Pitt because his pretty-boy looks often cause people to under-value what a good actor he is.<br /><br />So that is the gist of the movie and if reality (like the A's great pitching staff)can't be folded into the ultimate point, they have to go.-beenoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-19336675.post-18067506330747982712011-10-11T10:39:49.121-07:002011-10-11T10:39:49.121-07:00My favorite example of playing with reality in &qu...My favorite example of playing with reality in "Moneyball" is Billy Beane's daughter, in a scene taking place in December 2001, picking up a guitar in a music store and singing the song "The Show."<br /><br />"The Show" is originally by an Australian singer named Lenka, and was first released on her self-titled solo debut album -- in September 2008.Jimhttp://www.ellwanger.tv/noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-19336675.post-9062255695782472142011-10-11T09:31:05.347-07:002011-10-11T09:31:05.347-07:0023-year-old Fernando Valenzuela had only thrown 80...23-year-old Fernando Valenzuela had only thrown 800+ career innings at the time of the trade -- why would they think they'd still need Sid Fernandez?LAprGuynoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-19336675.post-18854110004478345092011-10-11T09:12:08.934-07:002011-10-11T09:12:08.934-07:00Great review, but a minor quibble. Beane became GM...Great review, but a minor quibble. Beane became GM of the A's in 1998, by which time Oakland had already drafted Mark Mulder and Tim Hudson. Zito arrived in 1999, so you could give credit to BB for his presence, but Beane inherited the other two.<br /><br />Agree with your overall point, though - nice to hear someone who isn't a stathead give Beane credit for developing a talented team.PNnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-19336675.post-56882563428517241862011-10-11T08:18:17.540-07:002011-10-11T08:18:17.540-07:00Was Grady, the scout a real name for a real person...Was Grady, the scout a real name for a real person? My guess is that it's a ficticious name for an amalgamation of different scouts. He came off looking like a total jerk.<br />I loved both the movie and the book by the way.Mike Barerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14447874605833321732noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-19336675.post-52308167047220086262011-10-11T07:54:15.326-07:002011-10-11T07:54:15.326-07:00Right-on, Ken. I've seen others complain that ...Right-on, Ken. I've seen others complain that ignoring the rotation shows the A's didn't win through their system at all... as if "Moneyball" means you only field a team of fat guys and Chad Bradfords. The A's valuations and the consensus valuation still mostly overlap. What's interesting - and therefore the focus of the book and movie - are those guys the A's saw value in that others did not.Ben Godarnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-19336675.post-71029454528872429132011-10-11T07:49:16.576-07:002011-10-11T07:49:16.576-07:00that should be
sorkin-on-jobs
sorry!
Pamthat should be <br /><br />sorkin-on-jobs<br /><br />sorry!<br /><br />PamAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-19336675.post-35102218918310012462011-10-11T07:49:09.572-07:002011-10-11T07:49:09.572-07:00We absolutely loved this and we are not even baseb...We absolutely loved this and we are not even baseball nuts...I thought the writing was crisp and I though brad Pitt gave a very understated performance-thanks for chatting about the book, my hubby picked it up right after the moviePatti Morfeld RN BSNhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13082680984896232062noreply@blogger.com