tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-19336675.post6288091179934209176..comments2023-11-03T06:02:02.128-07:00Comments on By Ken Levine: MONEYBALLBy Ken Levinehttp://www.blogger.com/profile/17305293821975250420noreply@blogger.comBlogger30125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-19336675.post-32929750697666278312009-07-18T08:40:28.438-07:002009-07-18T08:40:28.438-07:00Guys, you're assuming the statistics are the o...Guys, you're assuming the statistics are the only possible spine of the story. Would a movie based on the life of Warren Buffett have to be about the techniques of value investing?<br /><br />Sugar was disappointing. It started off fine, with interesting characters, settings and challenges, but the story arc never really went anywhere. It wound up being rather like a fictionalized documentary about what baseball means for poor people from the Caribbean.Mattnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-19336675.post-85951167859320592832009-06-26T19:19:06.860-07:002009-06-26T19:19:06.860-07:00Sugar was a great movie, and Bowdenmetrics made me...Sugar was a great movie, and Bowdenmetrics made me laugh.Jimnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-19336675.post-63960309122495693712009-06-25T16:08:44.991-07:002009-06-25T16:08:44.991-07:00I love baseball catfights.I love baseball catfights.Joehttp://blog.vinapedia.netnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-19336675.post-4275233801842458512009-06-25T02:18:03.266-07:002009-06-25T02:18:03.266-07:00Hi Ken,
I saw the film Sugar last night, and lov...Hi Ken, <br /><br />I saw the film Sugar last night, and loved it. Any thoughts?Unknownhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03499410913780120307noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-19336675.post-74445949689821472972009-06-24T19:41:43.014-07:002009-06-24T19:41:43.014-07:00Play-by-Play sounds so perfect, you know some suit...Play-by-Play sounds so perfect, you know some suit would have to stand in its way, Along a different path, how about a Jackie Robinson bio-pic made to 2010 instead of 1950 budgets and techniques?Mike McCannhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06369457898152250682noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-19336675.post-24239116556163407272009-06-24T18:51:34.640-07:002009-06-24T18:51:34.640-07:00Thanks for script link.
I love baseball movies, ev...Thanks for script link.<br />I love baseball movies, even one that ends with a montage of players getting to first base drawing a walk.<br />Maybe they just needed a jazzier title like "Good Eye, the Motion Picture."<br />I would have probably liked this more realistic baseball movie more than overly mythical baseball movies like The Natural and Field of Dreams.<br />There have been great baseball movies without the triumph of a win like Pride of the Yankees and Bang the Drum Slowly.<br />And as far as fans crunching numbers, it's probably healthier than crunching peanuts and Crackerjacks.Waynenoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-19336675.post-23947851404847717202009-06-24T17:48:05.790-07:002009-06-24T17:48:05.790-07:00Lest we forget, the A's won the World Series i...Lest we forget, the A's won the World Series in 1972-4. They might have been in contention in '75 if that bastard Charlie Finley hadn't broken the team up that year.Cap'n Bobhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11783977137812876489noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-19336675.post-73226756718000064052009-06-24T17:37:33.950-07:002009-06-24T17:37:33.950-07:00I think you sabermetrics guys are missing the poin...I think you sabermetrics guys are missing the point. Yes, they're valuable, yes the Red Sox also have the money to buy stars. But in terms of a MOVIE about Moneyball, if you got Steve Zallian (a great writer) or any A list writer you want to do a screenplay based on number crunching and savvy scouting leading to the playoffs and I write a more conventional screenplay about a Manny Ramirez type larger-than-life character leading his team to the playoffs I like my chances that my take will be a better movie.By Ken Levinehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17305293821975250420noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-19336675.post-57637531004648360642009-06-24T17:27:49.224-07:002009-06-24T17:27:49.224-07:00Yes, the Sox paid big $ to some players, but the b...Yes, the Sox paid big $ to some players, but the basis of a lot of their signings and deals was this new philosophy...guys like Ortiz are a Moneyball wet dream...they also hired Bill James...so I think it's not too far of a stretch to suggest sabermetrics had a lot to do with them being successfulJameshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05449692420450306435noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-19336675.post-21546446977377445402009-06-24T16:48:16.804-07:002009-06-24T16:48:16.804-07:00It's not quite accurate to say that the Red So...It's not quite accurate to say that the Red Sox won on sabermetrics. They spent quite a bit more money than the A's did on some occasionally risky players, and have the right manager in Terry Francona, who is not Theo's puppet a la Art Howe.Refnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-19336675.post-16037299057353465562009-06-24T16:19:28.380-07:002009-06-24T16:19:28.380-07:00Well if they could make a movie about the guy that...Well if they could make a movie about the guy that invented the intermittent windshield wiper, why not Moneyball? I, too, was surprised that Brad Pitt signed up for it and I thought Demetri Matrin was an odd casting choice for a movie like this, but I was certainly intrigued. Hopefully it survives somehow.Brianhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16226286722607371770noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-19336675.post-47390315464037237942009-06-24T15:38:16.999-07:002009-06-24T15:38:16.999-07:00Ken,
Have you seen SUGAR yet? Not Sabermetrics...Ken, <br /><br />Have you seen SUGAR yet? Not Sabermetrics as much as Bowdenmetrics.<br /><br />JohnJnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-19336675.post-21864715363810042142009-06-24T15:15:58.118-07:002009-06-24T15:15:58.118-07:00The premise reminds me of a typical White Sox &quo...The premise reminds me of a typical White Sox "rally" in the not too distant past: two walks, a fielder's choice, a HBP, an error on a bunt, a balk, another HBP, a passed ball and a sacrafice fly -- to the shortstop...<br /><br />wv: outsi -- the opposite of my navel, which happens to be an "insi"...Tom Quigleyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12959628996361620134noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-19336675.post-30371250141254732842009-06-24T13:11:24.936-07:002009-06-24T13:11:24.936-07:00@ MR.
If ESPN was making the movie...yes@ MR.<br /><br />If ESPN was making the movie...yesJameshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05449692420450306435noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-19336675.post-29367621949475498702009-06-24T13:01:20.456-07:002009-06-24T13:01:20.456-07:00WTF???!!! it's 2-0!WTF???!!! it's 2-0!blogwardhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07362291687463326731noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-19336675.post-55827403883056299762009-06-24T12:47:03.401-07:002009-06-24T12:47:03.401-07:00Just watching the USA winning 1-0 (so far) against...Just watching the USA winning 1-0 (so far) against the European soccer champions, Spain, in South Africa. Any thoughts on soccer, Mr. L?blogwardhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07362291687463326731noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-19336675.post-60249612501703257532009-06-24T11:28:51.266-07:002009-06-24T11:28:51.266-07:00"Yes, the A's started the Moneyball craze..."Yes, the A's started the Moneyball craze, and yes, they lose in the playoffs every time...BUT, the Red Sox also adopted the same philosophy and have 2 WS trophies."<br /><br />So the happy ending of the A's movie is that the Red Sox win? Just asking.Guy Nicoluccihttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10038097326310753461noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-19336675.post-37937869011252820012009-06-24T09:52:55.540-07:002009-06-24T09:52:55.540-07:00Not all interesting books can be turned into succe...Not all interesting books can be turned into successful dramatic movies. While "Moneyball" could make a fascinating documentary for baseball fans, it makes no sense at all as a $60 million feature film that would need to bring in twice that much just to break even. Not even Brad Pitt in the lead could make this turkey fly. <br /><br />Don't weep for Soderbergh, who will simply move on to the next project -- but as Mike pointed out, the people who really got burned here are the crew, who were all geared up to go. Instead of working for the next three months, they're suddenly back in the crowded pool of unemployment with so many other below-the-line workers.<br /><br />Whoever green-lit this bomb-in-the-making in the first place should be sent back to the mail room. <br /><br />As for the baseball issues: the Oakland A's did a terrific job with such severely limited resources, but no team can win it all without great pitching and hitting -- and that costs money. Money alone isn't enough (as the Yankees prove year after year), but Boston's excellent brain trust required a fat wallet to assemble those winning teams. Lacking such financial torque, the A's just couldn't get past the playoffs.Michael Taylorhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02569781786039595929noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-19336675.post-63626983055209142692009-06-24T09:22:49.320-07:002009-06-24T09:22:49.320-07:00Ken,
Yes, the A's started the Moneyball craze...Ken,<br /><br />Yes, the A's started the Moneyball craze, and yes, they lose in the playoffs every time...BUT, the Red Sox also adopted the same philosophy and have 2 WS trophies.Jameshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05449692420450306435noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-19336675.post-65582956912466786192009-06-24T09:11:30.542-07:002009-06-24T09:11:30.542-07:00Wow, you stats guys get soooo defensive. I'm ...Wow, you stats guys get soooo defensive. I'm not saying that statistics aren't helpful, I am saying it's hard to set up a dramatic VISUAL movie relying on them as the engine that powers your story. <br /><br />And when ultimately the A's do fall short every year I imagine the viewer saying, "then what's the point?" <br /><br />Oh, and quality starts are a stupid stat.By Ken Levinehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17305293821975250420noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-19336675.post-46558921704029752352009-06-24T08:59:58.414-07:002009-06-24T08:59:58.414-07:00Hey Ken,
This isn't much of a question as much...Hey Ken,<br />This isn't much of a question as much as a request. There's a new show called "Better off Ted." From reading your blog for the last two years daily, I think you'll enjoy the show. Whip-smart with a hot chick to boot! What could possibly go wrong? <br /><br />-DaveDavenoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-19336675.post-79119702805974626182009-06-24T08:52:16.889-07:002009-06-24T08:52:16.889-07:00This ranks with Spielberg's Lincoln film. The...This ranks with Spielberg's Lincoln film. The first story was that Doris Kearns Goodwin sold the rights to her book on Lincoln and his Cabinet. How do you sell the rights to well-known historical facts? Then it turned out she would merely consult. The movie still hasn't been made. Maybe someone plagiarized the screenplay?Michael Greennoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-19336675.post-2862408707739221612009-06-24T06:59:27.014-07:002009-06-24T06:59:27.014-07:00Ahh, but we have the two words Hollywood adores sl...Ahh, but we have the two words Hollywood adores slightly more than craft services: based on (see also insired by). I imagine the biggest thing the movie, if it's ever released, will have in common with the book is the title.Unknownhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11591597291569486561noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-19336675.post-42231805257273756752009-06-24T06:04:29.414-07:002009-06-24T06:04:29.414-07:00The story of drafting the fat catcher from Alabama...The story of drafting the fat catcher from Alabama represents a terrific story that any hack writer could create 20 minutes of material from. In the hands of someone who knows how to write, who knows? The book is rife with many stories similar to the catcher from Alabama.<br /><br />I agree with Mike' assessment of Columbia's upper management. Way to take a risk there. Instead, why don't you guys take the really dangerous route of adapting Welcome Back Kotter into a full length picture?<br /><br />And, Ken, you are right, the tactics of Sabermetrics don't work. It fails. Oh, wait. How are things working out for those people in Boston? If Oakland had some more money to work with, then maybe the A's could acquire more talent.<br /><br />Face it, Ken, Billy Beane got more out of those teams than he should of. While Oakland was making the playoffs, how many teams with twice and thrice the payroll expense as Oakland missed the playoffs while the A's made the playoffs?<br /><br />Look at it another way, Ken. What would happened to the A's if they had not followed the sabermetrics' logic? How many playoff appearances would they have? I am going with zero as in none.<br /><br />How can you say the strategy failed, Ken? They made the playoffs. By your reckoning, all but one team fails every year. That's a pretty high standard.<br /><br />Oh, wait, Ken. A team did win the World Series following the sabermetrics's logic. I guess the logic must now be considered a winner based on your criteria.<br /><br />You can fault sabermetrics for a lot of things such as its reliance on frequentist assumptions about the nature of events. It assumes data are normally distributed. It relies too much on linearity for my taste. Finally, it is not path dependent when its sample is clearly path dependent.<br /><br />That said, I would never say sabermetrics failed. The A's made the playoffs and the Red Sox won the World Series. In the alternate, by not following the sabermetrics' logic, then neither of those two events probably never occur.<br /><br />Finally, Ken, in the greatest baseball movie ever, SPOILER ALERT, the Bears lose to the Yankees in the championship game. And, SPOILER ALERT, Rocky loses the heavyweight title to Apollo Creed. But Rocky only won an Oscar for Best Movie (1976?)<br /><br />So, yes, Ken, only movies where the team or player wins the championship at the end are consider good or even great movies. By that measure, how many Oscars did Mighty Ducks collect? Oh, yeah, none.bevonoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-19336675.post-72226761663207462112009-06-24T04:14:32.248-07:002009-06-24T04:14:32.248-07:00As far as I know, Hatteberg had actually signed on...As far as I know, Hatteberg had actually signed on to play HIMSELF, among a bunch of other pros.<br /><br />Billy Beane is a great character because he's a dick to everyone. But he's a dick to everyone because he CARES. Touching, really.Monsterbeardhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12311231025129040824noreply@blogger.com