RyderDA is up first.
You mention how much is riding on the pilot of a series to you personally in order to keep watching for the long haul. Can you think of examples of weak pilots that turned into killer shows? How about strong pilots that became even better in Episode 2 and beyond?
The one that leaps to mind is PARKS AND RECREATION. HAPPY DAYS is another show that really took off after its pilot.
When characters break out, shows then take on a life of their own. The Fonz, Alex Keaton, Urkel all were happy surprises and their shows benefited greatly.
I’m sure you guys could name a bunch of weak pilots that became hit series. Most shows need time to grow since it’s not uncommon.
From Brian Phillisp:
You've mentioned favorite writers, actors and directors. Who were/are some of the favorite people you've worked with that are not one of the above?
I could list almost everyone on crews I’ve worked with. These dedicated craftsmen are the absolute backbone of the industry and don’t get nearly the recognition they deserve. I salute each and every one of them.
I would like to single out writers assistants we have had, however. David Isaacs and I wrote in a very unusual way. We dictated scripts to an assistant who took down shorthand. That was quite a skill (probably an obsolete one today) and we had some great assistants. So in no particular order: eternal thanks to Sue Herring, Lana Lewis, Nancy Kopang, Ruth Horne, Sherry Falk, Linda Silverthorn, Ginny Olah, Barry Zajac, Donna Wheeler, Katy Penland, and Roz Jacob.
Mike Bloodworth wonders:
Do you have notebooks, old napkins and/or computer files with potential jokes, premises, situations, etc., that you saved because you felt that you could use them someday? Sort of the comedy version of hoarding.
Follow up. If yes, have you used any of that archived material in, for example, in any of your recent plays?
I keep a manila folder of ideas — either for plays, TV series, or movies. Sometimes they’re rather detailed, other times they’re just a scrap of paper with one sentence. Most of these notions will never see the light of day, but every so often I’ll come up with something and realize a notion I had stashed away would work well with this.
But I never keep a joke file. My jokes come from character and attitude and are customized to fit the situation.
Long ago there was a comedy writer who traveled with card catalogs. The room would be looking for a joke on used car salesmen and he would rifle through his files to find “used car salesmen” jokes.
One time he was hired to write on a variety show being taped in London. His card files was in luggage that got lost. For three days he was absolutely useless in the room until the luggage was recovered. He's maybe the last writer I would ever hire.
And finally, from Steve McLean:
Just as 'Cheers' was becoming a huge hit, Ted Danson took a role in the TV movie 'Something About Amelia' playing a father who has been sexually molesting his daughter. The movie did well in the ratings and Ted won a Golden Globe for his performance but do you remember if the producers or the network were initially worried about him taking such a controversial role and its potential impact on the show?
I believe he filmed that before CHEERS. He also did a guest appearance on a show called TUCKER’S WITCH, which ran opposite CHEERS one night. We gave him a lot of shit for that one.
What’s your question? And at the risk of pissing off people because I want you all to be safe and healthy — get vaccinated.
The whole first season of SCHITT'S CREEK is pretty bad, but I think it got really good later on. The problem,, which I think is common to many shows, is that there was too much focus on the gimmick -- in this case, pampered rich people have to live in a nowhere town. If a show survives, particularly a comedy, it's not so much because of its gimmick but just because people enjoy spending time with these characters. Even on SEINFELD, the fact that Jerry was a stand-up comic became almost irrelevant to the show in later seasons.
ReplyDeleteMichael Keaton?
ReplyDeleteIt looks like Something About Amelia made its debut in January 1984--by that time Cheers was becoming established as a hit, but wasn't there yet. It was the era of important TV movies that got big ratings (it was the highest-rated program the week it aired according to Broadcasting magazine, and the second-highest rated TV movie of that season to that point behind The Day After.
ReplyDeleteAlthough I've never heard him discuss it, Rob Reiner co'wrote the first episode of "Happy Days." The story, titled "All the Way," aired Jan. 15, 1974 on ABC. (Garry Marshall was Reiner's brother-in-law at the time.)
ReplyDeleteRE: Ted Danson, when I met George Romero at a lecture in 2008, I asked him to sign my DVD copy of Creepshow. He spent about five minutes talking to me about the movie. He said that Ted Danson had learned he'd been cast on Cheers just as they were starting filming of Creepshow. He said Ted was a little worried what effect being in a horror movie would have on Cheers (and his career), but that Ted honored his commitment, even though he could have backed out, and George was impressed with his professionalism. Ted, of course, was great in his Creepshow role, and it had no negative impact on the show.
ReplyDeleteInteresting thoughts about the weak pilots that became strong series, but if you think about it, Happy Days was supposed to be about a group of kids in the 1950s, and increasingly became The Fonzie Show. Likewise Family Matters with Urkel. And I think of how Esther Rolle and John Amos may have overthought it but really didn't like how Good Times evolved into something that was dy-no-mite. I wonder if it's also that the premise changes.
ReplyDeleteHey Anthony - Michael J. Fox played Alex Keaton on "Family Ties" (82-89) - which pretty much became the Alex Keaton show after a while... Fox also somehow managed to star in "Back To The Future" one year while the show was in production (and not on hiatus).
ReplyDeleteIn general a pilot episode is not one of the better episodes of a series, especially after it evolves and the actors settle into their roles.
ReplyDeleteAn interesting exception is THE COSBY SHOW (putting aside his current personal life). The pilot was taken almost word-for-word from Cosby's standup act, and it was hilarious. I think the series coasted on the momentum of that first installment for a long time. Every episode (and season) after the pilot got progressively worse.
A Friday question, sure, why not? Pick me, pick me! :)
ReplyDeleteI was wondering about voice direction in TV scripts. For example, in Friends, Matt Perry's delivery of "Could it BE any more (blah)" only works with the right rhythm and direction in delivery. So my Q is if you have similar examples of phrases/lines that were delivered but only work through voice inflection, and how much it was in the script vs. the actor finding a way to say it?
Steve - I got that now. When this post first went up, it said "Michael Keaton" instead of "Alex Keaton," and my mind didn't make the leap to Family Ties. I was just confused why Ken included an actor on the list. Now he changed it so I look like a knucklehead, ha!
ReplyDeleteLet's flip the question. Any pilots that you thought were great that turned out to be bad shows?
ReplyDeleteThere was a documentary on Joan RIvers in which she showed the film crew her huge card catalogue of jokes, which filled an entire room. I suppose it makes more sense for standup comedy which is all about telling joke after joke, rather than situation comedy, which should come from character.
ReplyDeleteThese questions and answers are yet another reason to look forward to Fridays. I think Seinfeld turned out funnier than the pilot, or even season one for that matter. I think one reason is that the other characters were allowed to shine. When Julia, Jason, or Michael would get an award and the camera would flash to Jerry to get his reaction, you could tell that he was truly happy for them.
ReplyDeleteRe keeping a "joke file" -- In the late '70's I worked for Solters & Roskin, then a very prominent PR firm (handled Streisand, Sinatra, the Muppets, John Denver, etc) as Lee Solters' #2 west coast secretary. One of my responsibilities was maintaining the "item file," which was several index card boxes with "items" sorted by topic - the things gossip columnists used to run as filler, like a funny thing Star X said to a valet parking attendant, an amusing thing that happened to Star Y on a plane, etc. Boss would yell out "Find me something for Star Z to say to a dry cleaner!" I noted on each card the date sent & client named. Some of those items had been in use for decades.
ReplyDeleteAh, the old days of Hollywood fake news!
A Friday Question: many Dick Van Dyke episodes, and many episodes co-written by Garry Marshall, used a framing device where the story was told almost entirely in flashbacks. Someone who come to the police station to bail out someone else, and while waiting to be processed, the story of how the person landed in jail would be told.
ReplyDeleteI can't think of a single episode of my favorite shows post-1970 (outside of Garry Marshall scripts) that used this technique. Considering the most famous DVD episode, where Rob thinks he got the wrong baby from the hospital, used this format--why don't writers use it more? It seems like a great way to hook an audience early.
We boomer kids came to suspect that the guys who made Looney Tunes, Tom and Jerry cartoons and other shorts either had joke files or great memories. Of course, they were made in an era when cartoons and even movies dropped out of sight after finishing their initial theatrical runs.
ReplyDeleteAs always, thank you for answering my F.Q. Your blog is like a master class. I've learned so much from it. Too bad I haven't put any of it to good use yet.
ReplyDeleteM.B.
Last night CBS aired their Fall Preview Show (also available on YouTube — and undoubtedly Paramount+ as well) that opened with a big song-and-dance number led by Annaleigh Ashford (who stars in the CBS sitcom B Positive, in addition to her current role as Paula Jones in the FX Impeachment: American Crime Story).
ReplyDeleteIt's total schlock and/or a delightful throwback to yesteryear depending on your perspective.
FQ: Back in the day, network star(s) would often host these shows or appear in mini-skits to introduce new or returning programs. Were you or any of your colleagues ever involved in any of these (e.g. to write dialogue for an actor appearing in character as their sitcom alter ego)?
Hi Ken ! I recently finished re-watching Cheers daily during the pandemic and wondered about the episode where Sam reveals his hairpiece to Carla. I know you didn't write that episode , but whose idea was this ? Assuming it was not Ted Danson's idea, did he have any qualms about it and how did he react when the idea was first revealed ?
ReplyDelete@Kristen Foster: I agree with you about "Schitt's Creek." The first season was way too heavy on cringe humor -- how awful all the characters were, and all the embarrassments and humiliations they were forced to go through. There was still plenty of that as the show continued, but it also had some warmth as it developed the various relationships. Like many people, I never would have kept watching if it weren't for that change.
ReplyDelete@PolyWogg: I always thought it was interesting that scripts for "The Simpsons" write out Homer's "D'oh!" catchphrase as "(annoyed grunt)."
Hey Ken, I think you might have discussed this before, but what's it like directing child actors? Do you have to make sure they don't have that annoyingly "cutesy" acting style that used to be common on TV shows? And do you find that most comedy writers are good at writing for kids, or are they too often tempted to make them sound like wisecracking junior adults?
"Barney Miller" had a weak pilot that aired in August, 1974. ABC thought it showed promise and ordered a second pilot. The initial script was reworked, keeping only Hal Linden and Abe Vigoda from the first cast. It took sometime but the show went on to win numerous awards including the Golden Globe and the Emmy. It even won a Peabody. It was a brilliantly written, produced, directed and performed television series.
ReplyDelete@James: Aaron Sorkin has used the flashback technique a number of times and is, once in a while, a good example of why the technique is used so rarely.
ReplyDeleteOn the topic of series being much better than their pilots, the pilot to the Bob Newhart Show had Bob not only being a psychologist, but also the condo board president. They interacted with their neighbors more than the circle of friends from work, and other than one dream sequence late in the series, they never had kids, but in the pilot, they were hoping to get pregnant.
ReplyDeleteTo be fair, HAPPY DAYS started out as just as a small segment on LOVE AMERICAN STYLE, and the Fonz was actually in it, playing a more tough and stoic minor character. Not saying it was great, but it was very different from what the show became.
ReplyDeleteI think that the best shows got things right from the beginning. Of course, the CHEERS pilot is classic. All the principal characters were established perfectly, and the premise of the show was ready to go on from there.
MASH and FRASIER had a few bumps to work out at first, mainly ironing out some of the characters, but basically were on point from the first season.
I would say that most great shows did it right from the start. I can't think of any shows that sucked and got better.
Regarding Schitt's Creek, if the characters weren't so awful at the start there'd have been less room for them to grow. Of course their being awful was the gimmick, but I think it was necessary to establish the premise until it was no longer necessary.
ReplyDelete@Paul Knauer - I will give you that the "Glee" pilot sent me back into my couch as something I really hadn't seen before. But for me it didn't have legs as an actual series.
ReplyDelete@James -
ReplyDelete"I can't think of a single episode of my favorite shows post-1970 (outside of Garry Marshall scripts) that used this technique."
My memory may be playing tricks on me but I think both All in the Family and Mash went there a couple of times.
Friday Question: Have you read "Conversations with Wilder" by Cameron Crowe? It's from 1999 (the copy I got for $3 at a used bookstore has a Borders bookmark in it). I'm only one chapter in so far but it contains a lot of material about the creation of comedy. He also of course always had a collaborator, but in his case because his English wasn't good enough for him to write by himself. But the part I thought you'd like most was the story of how Joe E. Brown got the part of Osgood in "Some Like It Hot". Wilder and his collaborator I.A.L. Diamond were with their wives at Opening Day for the Dodgers at the Coliseum (I suspect "the" opening day, since the film was released in 1959) and for some reason Brown was one of the speakers in the pregame ceremonies. Wilder turned to Izzy Diamond and said, "That's our guy!"
ReplyDeleteSitcom episode told entirely through flashbacks? Well, How I Met Your Mother frames the entire series this way, as does, by implication, any series that uses the faux-documentary style of The Office, which cuts forward to characters talking to the camera from time to time.
ReplyDelete@PolyWogg - Great question, which can be applied to a favorite Cheers scene. Before Diane was set to go with Frasier to Europe, her and Sam were about to make out. On their way out the door, Diane says wait, and after his frustrated rant is told she only left her purse on the bar. The way Ted Danson said, "Oh... let me get that for you, Diane" makes that funny moment even more so. Love that part!
ReplyDeleteAn aside re: The Bob Newhart Show pilot, since it came up in the comments. Once, years ago on Anaheim's KDOC, I saw an earlier pilot in which Jerry and Bob shared an office, both as psychologists. Bob was traditional and Jerry embraced newer approaches such as scream therapy. Interesting how it evolved and that I've never seen it again.
ReplyDeleteQuestion for Ken: Ever get a network note that helped?
FRIDAY Question!
ReplyDeleteMy husband and I were discussing comedy shows 'taped before a live audience' where there would be a character so popular that their entrance would cause great reaction.So lots of applause, sometimes whoops from the audience, making the other actors stand around and wait. Was it problem? Because of timing the show. Or was it good thing? Popularity! or both?
Our list included Urkel, Schneider (One Day at Time), Kramer, Fonzie, J.J.(Good Times) but we think the first and best of these was Norton on the Honeymooners. Did he start it?
For the record, the "Fonz" didn't appear in the "Love and the Happy Days" segment of the ABC sitcom "Love, American Style," and Richie's Dad was played by Harold Gould.
ReplyDelete"Can you think of examples of weak pilots that turned into killer shows?"
ReplyDeleteIf dramas count, Cagney and Lacey.
@Gary-
ReplyDeleteIt feels like a lot of the stand up comedians that got series in the 80's/early 90's took the pilot from their routines. I remember thinking the same thing about the Cosby pilot. And Home Improvement. And Roseanne. And Drew Carey.
Not necessarily for the whole premise, but the jokes were often lifted directly from their routine.
The early Drew Careys had neighbors that didn't last past the first few episodes. I imagine that as Mimi became a bigger player in the show, there wasn't enough time to service work characters and home. The show "found its footing" as different version of the original.
The Seinfeld pilot is dire. Elaine had not been created, so the only female character was a waitress in the diner. The original diner set looked like Arnolds from Happy Days if I remember and George was really a Woody Allen-ish, nervous sort of character. Even Jason Alexander admitted to doing a bad Woody Allen impression until he got his own groove. Kramer was more unkempt and grubby (and he was called Kessler) instead of the manic neighbour we got as the season progressed. But the biggest crime was that it wasn't funny at all. It really was a miracle that one of the execs at NBC championed it and gave it a chance to come back with a more resolved show.
ReplyDelete